Saturday Pregame

Saturday, June 9, 2007

Today’s Lineup

Mack, LF; Iguchi, 2B; Thome, DH; PK, 1B; AJ, C; Dye, RF; Uribe, SS; Terrero, CF; Fields, 3B.  Garland pitching.

21 Comments

Big hit by Thome. I really hope we can get something going here.

Nope. I guess that’d be too much to ask.

This is getting pretty sad. I don’t even get that angry after losses anymore. I’ve come to expect losses, even against the Astros. You watch the game and figure the Sox did not nothing to win it.

Another solid outing by a starter. Another episode of the disappearing bats. This season is becoming very redundant.

Aerosmith sang it back in 1974- “It’s the same old story, same old song and dance, my friend…”

Remember a few days ago we had a ‘discussion’ (I guess you could call it that) about whether Sox fans have the power to change anything? My contention was yes…other’s no.

Here are some tidbits that may be of interest:

1. Sox attendence is off 2,500 a game compared to the same number of home dates last year.

If that continues at the same pace the rest of the year the Sox will be down 202,500 fans from 2006.

That’s a big drop considering the loss of revenue from concessions and parking.

And if the team continues to flush themselves down the toilet the drop off is going to get much, much worse.

2. Did you hear the chorus of ‘boos’ at the end of Friday’s lackluster performance? It appears the fans who stayed have had enough.

3. Speaking of staying, I’m getting some reports that the number of empty seats for the post game fireworks was staggering.

Apparently a lot of Sox fans are so angry they left before the post game fireworks. Now I can’t remember the last time something like that happened.

Circumstances seem to be favoring my position, that Sox fans can voice their displeasure and possibly force changes for next year. Will that be good or bad? Only time will tell.

Mark Liptak

I don’t think reduced attendance will force the type of changes that you have in mind. Do you really believe that Kenny Williams and Ozzie Guillen aren’t doing everything they can to win? The idea that they’ll say, “Gee, attendance is down–we’d better start trying to win,” is nonsense. And Reinsdorf is not about to fire the two guys who helped get him a championship after 25 years. I don’t see what difference attendance makes as a fan–unless you find it re-affirming to see that a bunch of strangers agree with your decision to purchase a ticket.

Let’s face it–sports are meaningless games and we as fans have ZERO control over the outcome. That’s the whole idea.

No, u gotta see whats on the horizon all–rebuilding is in the Sox future. Believe it or not if things continue as they are going Kenny WILL trade away the team, count on it! Buehrle and Dye are free agents at the end of the year, in my book I consider them gone. And there are some others who are plain dead weight (Pauly Mendoza–I mean Konerko). THese guys get me mad at all, it makes me sick…just plain sick to open the paper and see the Tigers, Indians and @!%$!@&*@!@!@!@ Twins above us….so, Im ready for the rebuilding process to occur…

David:

Three things wrong with your comments:

1. Who said anything about firing Kenny and Ozzie? All they have ever said was ‘we’re going to be compeditive EVERY year’ or ‘we’re not here to develop we’re here to win.’

In fact just about ten days ago Kenny was quoted directly as saying that someday “he hopes to have a Yankee sized payroll.” Perhaps you missed that?

My comments about making a statement are to try to force ownership to raise payroll even more. It’s obvious there wasn’t enough funds to go around and the bullpen and outfield were ‘short changed’ for the past TWO years.

2. If ‘games’ are meaningless then I quote you from a great American Robert Montgomery Knight. “If it doesn’t matter if you win or lose why do they keep the **** score…”

3. If sports are ‘meaningless’ the bookies in Vegas are sure wasting their time and efforts aren’t they? (and before you say anything no I don’t gamble, but a **** of a lot of folks do, don’t they?)

Mark Liptak

Just did a little research and found something I think is meaningful.

In three of the last four seasons (2004, 2006, 2007), the White Sox have found themselves trailing the divisional leader by double digits at some point in the season. (I was frankly surprised that a 90 win team did so, but it’s a fact.)

This tells me two things:

A. The A.L. Central has goten light years better since 2003 overall.

B. While the division has improved the White Sox apparently haven’t been able to keep pace on any type of a consistent basis.

Mark Liptak

Sox fans are smart consumers. As they continue to play like garbage the walk-up attendance will continue to drop, there will no longer be a waiting list for season tickets and the half price nights will have to come back.

All of this will happen unless Mr Reinsdorf and his investors decide they want to continue what they have had over the past couple years. Sox fans are the perfect example of “if you build it they will come” They have the money and the fan base to spend the money. Those of us on this blog can not change the franchise, but if management is willing to spend the money every seat will be full for every game.

For the life of me I can not understand why this team has fallen so low. I am beyond frustration. I feel the same as palehoses – I expect to lose coming into the game. Today the whole game I sat there thinking what will go wrong. That is no way to watch a game, but that is what this team has lead me to.

I was listening to White Sox Weekly yesterday and Rongey was talking with Singleton about Greg Walker’s future with the team. It seems a pretty straightforward decision, the team with the worst offense would more than likely fire their hitting coach, but I don’t think it would matter much. It’d be a cosmetic change done for the sake of change.

I remember a couple years back when the Indians fired Murray and the team went crazy. I don’t think we have that type of situation. We have some freakish team-wide, season-long slump going on. It’s not like these guys don’t know how to hit, it’s just they’re not hitting and ultimately, the onus falls on them to get it going. Unfortunately Walker might be out of a job because of these hitters, and if he does this team should be ashamed of themselves.

Anyway rooting for Buehrle to get that 100th today. Who knows what the future holds but in all liklihood Mark won’t be a part of it next year. It’s a shame because Mark’s been one of my favorite players and just an all around good-guy but he’s one of the few players that’ll demand something good in return…

Anybody else see what’s going on with Freddy? The writing was on the wall last season. I always thought we should have gotten more than Floyd and Gio from the trade, but that’s looking like a deal now…

I haven’t heard much of anything about Crede’s progress. Is he electing to get surgery? And if so how’s that gonna effect him on the free agent market? At least Joe has an excuse for his play, one herniated disc is bad enough, two have gotta be absolutely miserable.

Let’s avoid the sweep fellas!

Palehoses,
I hate to say it because I have always liked Greg Walker since he was with the Sox in my early fandom, but maybe him getting fired is the only thing that might get these players fired up. They genuinely like Walker as a coach and friend. Maybe knowing they cost him his job might wake them up, or of course it could make it worse. The hitting coach is always the fall guy.

You are right, the writing was on the wall last season when Garcia tried to go away from being a power pitcher. He knew something was wrong, and now it looks like we may not have to face him this week. Although you know the guy he is, he would love to face the team that traded him especially as awful as we are hitting right now.

It’s hard to say about Crede’s free agent value. If Josh Fields is the 3rd baseman of the future I’m sure the Sox would like the opportunity to trade Crede and at least get something in return. The problem is that with the injury it will be hard to get a good return in trade this year. If he has the surgery he is most likely out for the season. They can give him another qualifying offer for 2008 and trade him then, but his value could drop severely if he is not playing. It will be interesting to see this play out because I really like Joe, and would love to see him here if that back problem can be fixed.

Mark,
I just don’t see how sagging attendance will increase the payroll. If you believe the GM is sincerely trying to win and that increased revenue will help him, then you should faithfully fill the stadium (or at least purchase a ticket) year-in and year-out to give him the resources to make moves freely. If you think the problem is Reinsdorf and his commitment to winning, then you have a problem until he dies or sells the team. But really, if I’m going to come up with a spending strategy to help society, it’s going to focus on hunger, homelessness, or education, not baseball. Because sports are MEANINGLESS. Bobby Knight and others feeling competitive and wanting to win doesn’t mean the game has any more significance. And the bookies are just trying to make a buck, like the people who are gambling. Vegas has odds on all sorts of things–it doesn’t make them meaningful.

David:

Then if sports are ‘meaningless’ why are you a Sox fan, why do you post?

Why isn’t that time being spent more productively ‘trying to change the world?’

Just a you feel sports are meaningless, I feel that trying to change the world isn’t going to happen.

The world is a **** of a lot bigger then any individual and why frankly, when you’re trying to deal with madmen and ******, it isn’t going to happen.

But you do as you choose as will I.

To me sports are far more important, but remember I’m just a middle class American.

Mark Liptak

Uribe, Konerko, and Terrero looking like a young Caballo on that swing. I’m with kenwo on Terrero. The more I see of him the more I like him. Hope we can hold on for the win and for Mark.

Mark,
I don’t post often. In this case I thought you were feeling bad about the team and setting yourself up for feeling worse later. I think sports are supposed to be a release from life’s problems, not another problem to add to the list.

You definitely could change the world–maybe not in a big way, but in small ways of your choosing. There are a billion people living in third world countries whose lives carry one iota of the potential for change that yours does. They would love to be “middle-class Americans.”

i was going to post earlier to guarantee a Mark win today, but i guess you all won’t give me that one, so i’ll just say, congrats, Mr. Buerhle, and many many more. i remember Early Winn going for his 300th in a Sox uni only a “few years” back and he struggled mightily! to get that milestone.

i have been reading daily, but haven’t bothered to post for several reasons. most of you have valid points of view and i note that there are some newcomers to this blog of Scott’s so welcome and keep the interesting ideas/comments/complaints coming. there is always room for quality opinions from quality fans of this team….

o.k. so when is this team going to morf into the quality that we all expect to see and root for? maybe it’s Marks win today that will propell us to some sort of streak and into the mix of competitiveness. but who knows? the one thing that i’ve noticed this past week of futility is that the bitter rancor is gone and replaced by a sort of resigned acceptance of the state of this team. to me this looks like we are back to the holding pattern of previous years when noone expect us to win and any elevated play is greeted with a tempered sense of doom-awaiting. what am i talking about? me thinks that the White Sox Community is back to reality. i have to admit that i too was swept up in the success of the 2005 season and fully expected that success to translate to continued success, but we all know how that turned out, and now we are enduring the early prognosticators delight, namely a mediocre Sox team that can’t seem to hit when it needs to and can’t pitch when important to do so.

so why are there new posters? it would seem to me that there wouldn’t be any posts . the old standby’s are MIA, but replaced by newcomers who have ….. o.k. i’m rambling, so i’ll sign off now with a Sox win today and get ready for something REALLY important (davidanderson) the Sopranos…. j.k., still here in tucson…

Congratulations to Mark, a very good pitcher and from what I understand an even better teammate.

In his time with the Sox I’ve never heard anyone ever accuse Mark of dogging it or not caring.

Today that’s a great compliment (and also says something about a lot of today’s players.)

Best wishes to him in the future hopefully on the South Side but I won’t guarantee that.

Mark Liptak

I’m just happy that the stupid Groundhog Day movie seems to be over, and we won on a *Sunday* (haven’t done that so much this year)!!

Big congrats to Mark on win #100! Let’s hope this is the start of a winning streak.

Congrats to Mark. A great accomplishment for him to reach. Hopefully his next 100 wins will be in a White Sox uniform as well. If there is someone to break the 3 year contract standard for pitchers this is the guy.

As for Terrero I was a doubter at first, but am starting to see some things I like from him. He swings for the fences a lot and his defense has been a little iffy, but he is starting to grow on me. If he can settle in and hit for average and pick his spots to swing for the home run he could have a very lenghty stay here.

i told you people about terrero 2 weeks ago. the sox are wasting at bats with mackowiak, owens, sweeney, anderson…..this guy is the real deal. he should be an everyday player. he’s powerful, runs like a deer, and has a rocket for an arm! get him in there! as for the buehrle, it would be a shame if the sox traded him. i think he should be resigned. i admit i havent been the biggest supporter of his throughout the years but he takes the ball and usually gives a fine effort. the sox dont have anyone to replace him (though they will try to fool you with names of broadway, gio gonzalez and gavin floyd…) if those guys were that great they would be in our pen now. sign buehrle for god sake.

Kenwo, unfortunately the way it is going Broadway, Gonzalez and Floyd may get the next shift in the Sox bullpen. It appears to be a season of trying guys and see who sticks. So far nobody but Jenks deserves to stick around.

Im w/ ya Jim, Jenks appears to be the only thing worth salvaging in that enept bullpen. ****, they got a better chance pulling folk from the stands to hold a lead than to bring them bums out. Maybe not–but its not far from that! Im having a tough time remembering a Sox bullpen this atrocious! Maybe towards the end of Thigpens run?? Im hard pressed to remember a bullpen this brutally bad, I mean Ive seen game after game get out of reach because of these losers–im sorry, other than Jenks the bullpen is trash!

As u can tell, Im a frustrated Sox fan like all u guys. To be 100% honest, I wasnt expecting too much from the Sox this year after Kenny wnet and traded away Garcia and McCarthy–but looking at the kinds of years theyre having elsewhere–go Kenny. But as for the guys at the plate, oh lord *shakes head in disbelief*–is any of the everyday players batting over .280?? I think Thome is the only one! ONE! PATHETIC! Even if that “fact” is off, u get my point, cant win if u dont score runs–that simple..even worse if u DO score runs ur bullpen hands the game over in the later innings—what a joke. How things change in Sox-dom in a mere 16 months…..

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